239: Run, Walk, and Remembering the Legacy of Jeff Galloway

Jeff Galloway didn’t just teach people how to run. He taught people to believe they belong. We put our normal Rise and Run format on pause to honor Jeff’s life and collect the stories that explain why his impact feels so personal to so many runners, from first-timers to legends.

You’ll hear from ultrarunner Dean Karnazes on Jeff’s generosity, his love of marathon history, and the Greece trip that’s now becoming a Jeff Galloway Memorial Tour. Amby Burfoot takes us back to a time when running on the roads made you look like an alien, then explains how Jeff helped turn a misunderstood pastime into a welcoming, mass-participation sport. Bill Rogers discusses what he respected most: Jeff’s kindness, the way he made strangers feel like friends, and the joy he injected into marathon culture.

Coach Chris Twiggs shares what it’s like to learn directly from Jeff’s books and mentorship, and why the run-walk-run method is really about sustainable marathon training, injury prevention, and keeping the doors open for beginner runners. Westin and Carissa Galloway close the circle with the family view: the same calm, curious, proud dad at home is the one you meet at a runDisney expo, answering emails, remembering your story, and insisting you take credit for your own finish lines.

 If Jeff ever helped you think, “I didn’t know I could do this,” you’re already part of what Jeff built.

Links
Jeff Galloway
Amby Burfoot
Bill Rodgers
Dean Karnazes
Carissa Galloway

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Transcript

Why This Tribute Episode Matters

SPEAKER_13 0:47

Hi, friends. Welcome to episode two hundred and thirty-nine of the Rise and Run Podcast. I'm Bob, and I'm here for this episode with Jack.

SPEAKER_10 0:58

Hiya.

SPEAKER_13 0:59

With Alicia.

SPEAKER_10 1:00

Hello.

SPEAKER_13 1:00

With Greg. Hey, hey, hey. And with John. How are you doing? I'm doing well, John.

SPEAKER_09 1:06

Thank you for asking. The Rise and Run Podcast is sponsored by Magic Bound Travel and Stokes Metabolic Training.

SPEAKER_02 1:12

We'd also like to thank our Patreons whose support helps keep the Rise and Run Podcast rising and running. And as always, and each and every single week, Patreons, thank you so much for your support.

Dean Karnazes On Jeff’s Heart

SPEAKER_13 1:24

Friends, by now, of course, you figured out that this week's episode's a little different. The intro's been a little different. There will be no training updates, no race report, none of the normal stuff. All of that will return next week. This week, we're taking time to celebrate the life of our friend, Jeff Galloway. A man who meant so much to this family and to so many runners around the world. Jeff wasn't just an Olympian or a coach. He was someone who had a gift for making people feel seen, supported, and capable of more than they ever thought possible. For many of us, he was the reason we started, or the reason we kept going. In this episode, you're going to hear from people who knew Jeff in different ways. Friends, fellow runners, members of his family, as we share their stories, their memories, and the impact he had on all of us. We hope this is more than just an episode. We hope it feels like a chance to reflect, to smile, and to remember someone who truly made our sport that much better. Thanks for being here with us.

SPEAKER_12 2:47

Caution Runners, change of topic ahead.

SPEAKER_13 3:06

Like, for instance, 50 marathons in 50 states in 50 days. That's just the tip of the iceberg, friends. But more important to today's conversation, he's someone who's a close friend of Jeff. We're grateful he's taken a few minutes to join us. Share some memories, help us celebrate Jeff's life and legacy. Dean Carnassus, welcome to a special episode of the Rise and Run podcast.

SPEAKER_16 3:29

Oh, it's an honor to be here. Thank you. And uh celebrating the life of such a wonderful man that I uh it was near and dear to my heart and a mentor to me in so many ways.

SPEAKER_13 3:38

Awesome. Absolutely. Uh so many of us feel the same way. That's wonderful. Uh Dean, how did your path first cross? You remember when you first met Jeff?

SPEAKER_16 3:48

I don't remember the year, but I remember he invited me to his running store. So I did a book signing and um we did a group run and then a pizza pizza. Yeah. Yeah. And I just loved him. From that uh point on, we've been uh close friends. So I don't I don't remember the year actually, but it he was a young man then.

SPEAKER_13 4:10

We were both watching every there's a lot of that going around. Uh was that was that when the store was in Tallahassee or Atlanta?

SPEAKER_16 4:19

It was in Atlanta.

SPEAKER_13 4:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_16 4:21

Atlanta. It was in Georgia, yeah.

SPEAKER_13 4:23

What do you think some of the qualities were that made Jeff unique?

SPEAKER_16 4:27

I, you know, he was one, a very lovable character. And it was, it was, it was so obvious it it was genuine. I mean, he's just an authentic guy and just an authentic, nice guy. And he just gave himself uh to people, he gave us all to people. And so many times we'd been like at um uh expos together, you know, working for sponsors or you know, one of our publisher's um bookstalls, and he'd be there for five or six hours.

SPEAKER_13 4:55

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_16 4:56

And then I kept saying, Jeff, you're gonna the marathon is tomorrow. You you know, you're not gonna make it to the starting line. But uh yeah, I mean, I think his willingness just to give everything he had to every person he touched, I think is what set him apart.

SPEAKER_13 5:11

He would do that at Disney too. He'd be at that booth all hours, and then at first out on the course, and then in the in the later years, uh, out at the end to greet all the runners.

SPEAKER_00 5:21

I can think of a couple sayings myself, but is there anything um that you can think of that Jeff had any habits or sayings or quirks that you remember fondly of him?

SPEAKER_16 5:31

Uh I remember he said something to the extent of like you you don't he said to someone that they said, Oh, I'm just trying to run a you know finish the marathon. He said, You don't have to go fast, you just have to go. So just you just can't stop, you know. That was kind of it. You don't have to be this, you know, the in the in the front of the pack, but uh you just you just gotta keep going.

SPEAKER_13 5:51

Oh, that's what endeared him to a lot of the folks who listen to this podcast is he he truly loved, respected, and was proud of all of us.

SPEAKER_16 5:59

Well, and you know, I'm a I'm a hundred percent Greek, so I'm you know, I and I studied classics, and you know, Jeff is one of the few um runners that really knows the history of the marathon. Right. And that was something that we discussed frequently because he was so fascinated um with the you know the the foundation story, and I don't blame him. I mean that you know the marathon is such a unique sporting event in that you know it his roots date back 2,500 years ago, and it was too, you know, the origins were from something very heroic, you know. The Fidipides or Phoedipides did absolutely so you know he he just embraced that story. Obviously, he named his his store after after that runner, so yeah.

SPEAKER_13 6:40

He sure did. I'm he had a uh virtual running series at one time where he would relate some of the history of Phodipides and the Greek runners of the day and how they were ambassadors, and uh fascinating. And when we get fin get towards the end here, we want to talk about the trip you got coming to Greece because I know that was a big part of what Jeff wanted to do.

SPEAKER_16 7:02

Yeah, and no, and then what you're referring to is called the Phodipides Challenge. So Jeff and I collaborated on that. It was yeah, it was basically it was during COVID, and he said, let's do a virtual, and it was basically uh running the original. I mean, the the backstory of the marathon is stretches beyond 26.2 miles. So he he's you know, he knew about the runner leaving from uh Athens and running to Sparta and back before running the final marathon. So the distance included that. It was I can't remember the exact I think it was 326 miles somewhere around there.

SPEAKER_12 7:32

Oh golly.

SPEAKER_16 7:33

Yeah, and you had one year. You know, it's uh obviously the the top 10 guys all tried to do it the quickest, but uh a lot of people, you know, took it took them eight or nine months to to cover that distance. But everyone got a medal and it was it was very successful.

SPEAKER_13 7:46

Can you think of a story, Dean, that uh captures who Jeff was beyond the coach? Maybe something that we wouldn't know about him?

SPEAKER_16 7:54

Uh, you know, I remember um running with him in Atlanta. We did a group run, and this was uh at a different time than uh out of his store. So I can't remember what the occasion was. There's probably 20 to 30 runners, and we all went out, and you know, obviously um there were some people that were speedy that finished quickly, and you know, Jeff and I were somewhere ahead of the middle of the pack, let's say. And but we ran pretty hard, you know, and it was it's Atlanta, it was hot and humid, and and we pushed. Uh, and then we got to the finish, and he said, I'm gonna go back now. I said, Where? Home? Like to the shower? He's like, No, I'm gonna go, I'm gonna go back, run, run in with the rest of the runners. Oh and he turned around and ran back there and yeah, hooked up with the the last people coming in.

SPEAKER_00 8:38

Wow. So we know that you knew Jeff for a long time. Um, are there any behind-the-scenes stories from races or speaking engagements that you would like to share with us?

SPEAKER_16 8:47

One thing I will share, it's it's somewhat related, is just his devotion to Bard, his wife.

SPEAKER_13 8:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_16 8:53

And how he was always, you know, that was the one the one person he would like cut things short and and leave for is if he if she needed to be together with him or you know, he had to take care of her. So I just remember this devotion and thinking that uh that loyalty again gets back to his character. What a what a great guy this guy was.

SPEAKER_13 9:12

I know after Jeff injured his knee, I got a chance to see him a couple times, Disney races. And uh I didn't bother asking Jeff how he was doing because I knew what he would say. Oh, I'm doing great. I always asked Barbara. And when I saw him in January at Disneyland, I asked Barb how he was doing, and she said he's actually doing real well this time. So I mean, it was close to the end, but I'm glad. I'm glad that he was doing well there. That's great. Here's one if Jeff were sitting here right now, what story would he tell us about Dean Carnassus?

SPEAKER_16 9:49

Oh I remember someone peeing in the bushes. I don't know if you tell that story, but um, you know, he I think he would say that you know, our our uh our mutual um love of history was something that you know we discussed. And I was always coming up with new little bits and pieces that he was unaware of, and he always found those so fascinating.

SPEAKER_13 10:21

Yeah, so we glossed right over the pain in the bushes stuff.

unknown 10:25

Okay.

SPEAKER_16 10:27

Come on, we're all runners. Yeah. Oh heck yeah. It gets worse than that, yeah. Oh, yes, indeed.

SPEAKER_00 10:33

All right, Dean. So Jeff introduced so many people to running through the run-walk-run method. From your perspective, how did he change the sport of running?

SPEAKER_16 10:42

You know, he made running more approachable to the masses. So I think that he humanized the marathon. He's, you know, he said that look, I mean, I have this quote. Um, someone asked me one time, how long does it take the average person to run a marathon? And I said, average people don't run marathons. But he would say, Oh, you know, there's no average, you don't, you can, it doesn't matter what your body type's like. Uh, you know, with the run walk method, you you we can get you that medal. You know, we can get you to the finish line.

SPEAKER_00 11:10

I think that goes into a question that our friend John, who couldn't be here today, um, had. And he's he wanted to know, he would say that Jeff had a way of making runners believe in themselves. Who was that person to you that Jeff would come and and really truly um make you believe in yourself? Is there any um stories or things that he told you that helped you as a runner?

SPEAKER_16 11:34

I mean, he taught me about the the run walk method because you know, he said, um I said, I, you know, Jeff, I'll be honest. I he said, Have you tried it? I said, I really haven't. Um and he said, Yes, you have. And I said, Huh? And he said, You're an ultramarathoner. Don't you walk the hills?

unknown 11:51

Right.

SPEAKER_16 11:52

And and the the light bulb went off. I'm like, click. So I've done a lot of I'm following his technique quite a bit on ultramarathons. And you don't hear so much about it with ultra marathon, you know, about ultra marathoning, because most ultramarathoners take breaks just when they have to. But um introducing this actual um protocol has really helped me.

SPEAKER_13 12:12

Dean, when people talk about Jeff 5, 10, 50 years from now, what do you hope they'll say?

SPEAKER_16 12:19

That he was a pioneer. I hope that they'll say that in so many ways, not only with his run walk uh method, but you know, with run specialty in the in the business world of running, he was ahead of his time. You know, the the idea of a run specialty store never existed before Jeff Galloway. And now that you know you have uh fleet feet, you've got Rib Runner Sports. I mean, you know, the list is long. He pioneered that that whole um genre of of retail existence. He truly did.

SPEAKER_00 12:47

If a brand new runner came to you and asked you about who Jeff Galloway was, how would you describe him in a sentence or two?

SPEAKER_16 12:54

Uh he was uh uh an Olympian that you could shake his hand.

SPEAKER_13 12:59

Oh heck yeah.

SPEAKER_16 13:00

He's not on a pedestal. He'll look you right in the eye and say it's it's an honor to me. It's great to meet you, and he'll be sincere.

SPEAKER_13 13:07

What do you think the best way is for runners to honor Jeff's legacy?

SPEAKER_16 13:12

Uh, you know, just carry him in your heart when you're running. You know, think think about some of the stories you've heard from me, and I'm sure others. Uh, and you know, and this guy loved to run. I mean, he just he loved running. And a lot of people nowadays, you know, they run for a reason. There's a cause. There's got to be, you know, every run is quantified. There's a reason they're running, there's training or losing weight or whatever. Jeff just loved to run for the sake of running itself. And I think that's really a beautiful thing.

SPEAKER_13 13:41

It surely was. Absolutely. Now, I know that you and Jeff had a trip planned to Greece. That's still on. Can you tell our friends about it? And maybe if they're interested, how they can find out more.

SPEAKER_16 13:55

Yeah, so um Jeff and I had been working for about a year on planning a trip, a retreat, a running retreat to Greece to experience Marathon, the actual place where the marathon began, uh, to go to the Delphi, see some of the ancient stadiums. And he was so much looking forward to this. He hadn't been to Greece in over almost two decades. And yeah, and we had a group of um about uh 10 people signed up uh to come over to Greece with Jeff and go on this on this tour. And it was foot tourism, we called it. So the, you know, you'd you'd tour every like Athens, you'd tour the Acropolis, you know, the the Colin Mario Stadium, all by by just shuffling around Athens, you know, running or walking around Athens, which was just an excuse that we could eat more food at night. Yes, and and then I had planned a surprise, it was uh it was chilling, but I had planned a surprise that the mayor of Marathon, so the municipality of Marathon in Marathon, there's a beautiful museum there, the Marathon Run Museum. They were gonna give um an honorary award to Jeff. And uh, so all these runners, you know, it was gonna be a big surprise. And the day I called Weston, his son, to tell him, hey, Weston, you know, we're gonna honor your dad. You know, you think Barbara, any of the family members want to come, he's like, Oh, you're not gonna believe this. I've got some really tragic news.

unknown 15:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_16 15:18

Yeah. He's he passed away. Uh, and I thought, you know, I I I said to the people that signed up, I'm sorry about this, and uh, you know, I'll refund your money. And a couple of them said, No, can we still come? And eventually all of them, when they heard others were coming, like, let's do this. Let's just rename it the Jeff Galloway Memorial Tour. And it'll all be about sharing memories about Jeff where we're out there experiencing these places. Uh, and he'll be looking down uh upon us with a smile on his face.

SPEAKER_13 15:44

There's that legacy again. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:46

I know he shared many stories about the history of the marathon, and I I know that love that he had for um doing what doing the sport and then also the history behind it. So I'm sure it will still be an amazing trip.

SPEAKER_16 16:01

And he'll have a bronze uh memorial plaque at the Marathon Red Museum, which is in Marathon, right at the start of the Athens Marathon starting line. So have a bronze plaque there for all to see and memorialize him, yeah. Like you said.

SPEAKER_13 16:13

How appropriate, how wonderful. Dean, thanks so much. Thanks so much for taking the time. Friends, you don't know. Dean's in Greece as we speak. So uh he had to arrange his schedule. We arranged ours so we could make this happen. And we we're we're very grateful to you, sir. Thank you for doing it. Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_16 16:31

If you ever want to run the Athens Marathon or come tour Greece, get in touch with me. Happy to happy to host you.

Amby Burfoot On Early Running Culture

SPEAKER_12 16:37

Caution runners, the topic is about to change right now.

SPEAKER_13 16:42

Andy Burfitt is someone whose name is woven into the fabric of the running world. He's a Boston Marathon champion, an accomplished author, and the former executive editor of Runner's World magazine. But today we're especially grateful to have him here because he knew Jeff Galloway not just as a figure in the sport, but as a contemporary, as a colleague, and as a friend. We are honored that uh Andy's joining us to share some memories and help us celebrate Jeff's life and legacy. Andy Berfert, welcome to the Rise and Run podcast, and thank you for joining us.

SPEAKER_01 17:22

Bob, thank you so much for the invitation. It's great to be here with you.

SPEAKER_13 17:26

Yeah, we we are we are very grateful.

SPEAKER_01 17:29

Uh take us back, please, sir.

SPEAKER_13 17:31

Uh what was a running world like when you first got to know Jeff Galloway?

SPEAKER_01 17:37

When I first got to know Jeff Galloway, there was no recognizable running world as such. Uh, those of us who were running down the streets in what everybody else assumed was our underwear. And uh therefore we were ripe with comments flying from car windows as people drove past, and occasionally uh there were Coke cans and beer cans and worse coming after the after the comments. So uh it is hard for people today to imagine what it was like then. And I don't I don't mean to say we were under attack, that would not be true, but we were completely not understood. Nobody could understand why somebody would be out there on the streets in what looked like their underwear and doing something that everybody knew was really, really, really, really hard, which is running a mile or two miles. That was torture, that was pain and agony for people, it was punishment. And so uh we were we were looked at as a different breed for sure.

SPEAKER_13 18:49

Yeah. I I think I remember Jeff or perhaps some other long-distance runners saying that people thought you were boxers because you were trying to get endurance and get into shape.

SPEAKER_01 18:58

Well, Jeff had some muscle. I have none, so nobody ever accused me of being a boxer. I thought I was a basketball player at one point, but I didn't have power in jumping for that. But you're right, but uh boxers were known to train on the roads in the early morning running. Uh, we were doing the same, but uh the body types were usually a bit different. When did you first meet Jeff? Well, that's a really good story. I'll I want to tell it, but I will try to do it in a shortish, coherent way. So I went to Wesleyan in the fall of 1964, and in high school, I had had the unbelievable good fortune to be coached by the country's greatest runner and marathoner, John J. Kelly, who won Boston and went to two Olympics in the marathon. So his influence was very, very significant on me. And after a couple of years of running behind Kelly, I knew that one day I wanted to be like him, which meant that one day I wanted to run the marathon like he had. And there was essentially no one else, you know, in an entire state region that wanted to run marathons then. But I did, and so I walk onto the campus at Wesleyan University in Middletown, Connecticut, in the fall of 64. And there's this guy who I know nothing about, but he is one year older than me. He's on the cross-country team as I am, and he has already run a marathon. What was it, the peach ball marathon in 63 or something? Jeff has run a marathon, and he, like me, was inflamed with a passion to see where we could go in distance running. And so to have this, first I had Kelly as my coach in high school, and then I have Galloway as my training partner in college. Uh, I was the most lucky and blessed person you could possibly imagine. And uh I would say that Jeff and I ran together almost every day for three years at Wesley, and it was an incredible partnership that we had.

SPEAKER_13 21:15

Well, we know he mentioned you often. So it must have been a mutually uh beneficial or mutual admiration uh type of relationship.

SPEAKER_09 21:25

Jeff became known for making running accessible to everyone with his run-walk-run. Did that stand out right away or did it evolve over time?

SPEAKER_01 21:34

I don't know the answer to that. Uh what I know is that while the run-walk-run is what Jeff is known for, I think that's almost a misdirection. I think what Jeff should be known for is what you already said, and that was making running accessible to the masses, making fitness accessible to the masses. Masses. I mean, I think Jeff uh was always happy if he could get somebody walking a few miles a day before they delved into any run-walk-run. He was happy if uh he could get them to change their diet just slightly to eliminate a few things and include some other things. He was an Olympian, he was the winner of that peach ball marathon and the winner of the first peach tree road race, an absolutely top-tier teammate with Frank Shorter and Steve Briefontaine and people like that. And yet when his days were over, his competitive days, rather than trying to become a college coach or an elite running coach, somehow he found the mission that his goal in life was to help people get fitter. And he knew running best, and he knew that run, walk, run was a very good way, the only way, really, to get beginners into the sport. And he took this message on the road to nobody can count how many stops on that whistle stop train Jeff was on, flying around the country and the world. But he delivered his message with such passion and such sincerity and such really love and respect for the people in his audience that they believed this ridiculous thing that they could run two miles, or maybe they could run 10 miles, or maybe they could someday run a marathon, which the first time you think about it, it is unthinkable. But Jeff believed in people, he had a system, he had a method, and he was there every moment of every day to guide people to reach their goals.

SPEAKER_13 23:52

Beautifully said, and 100% we we are we're part of that legacy. An expression, and I don't know if it's Jeff's expression or remember when you thought this was impossible? And now you're doing it. And Jeff was responsible for a lot of that. Do you have a favorite memory or story that captures who Jeff was?

SPEAKER_01 24:13

Well, I remember training with Jeff the best, you know? And I I think the thing that was most special about our training together for three years is when you hear about other top runners training together in colleges especially, they all and they always end up racing each other in most of the workouts and killing each other and causing injuries and overtraining and fatigue and not reaching your best. Jeff and I never, ever, ever raced each other in training. Uh we could have, I suppose, but it didn't cross either of our minds because we both believed that we were better together than we were against each other in any way, shape, or form. We both believed in the philosophy of train, don't strain. We both believed that one workout didn't make a difference, and a week of workouts didn't make a difference. It was months and years of workouts that could make a difference. And the only way you do months and years is if you moderate your training, uh, work with your friend and teammate and training partner, and each of you, uh, your job is just as much to improve the other person as it is to improve yourself.

SPEAKER_13 25:30

Was there ever a moment either in uh running or just in personal life that Jeff surprised you with something?

SPEAKER_01 25:37

Wow, that is a good question. I I don't remember uh a surprise of the kind that you're hinting at. What I remember as a very pleasant memory is I think there was only one time that Jeff and Bill Rogers and I were together uh at a clinic at a Jeff Galloway half marathon. So here were the three of us from Wesleyan who made our various contributions to running. And I enjoyed that session with the three of us talking so much because the amount of respect we had for each other in that room was just astonishing. And every time Bill opened his mouth, Jeff and I were listening attentively and responding afterwards. The same with Jeff, the same with me. Uh, I give our credit, uh our university Wesleyan, some credit for making us into educated, thoughtful, listening people. But uh together, uh, I wish we had that on tape. That would have been a uh a videotape for the ages because we just enjoyed each other so much. We just appreciated each other's different accomplishments. We we went different ways, but in a sense, we all went with the same purpose, and it really showed that day in Atlanta at his half marathon.

SPEAKER_13 27:02

I am sorry I missed that one.

SPEAKER_01 27:04

Wow.

SPEAKER_13 27:06

That must have been remarkable. Thanks for sharing that. Uh when you look at the running community today, where do you see Jeff's fingerprints?

SPEAKER_01 27:15

Oh, I think Jeff's fingerprint is bigger than any of us realized until unfortunately in death there was this amazing, overwhelming response from all of the individuals all around the world who left messages on various message boards, whether Facebook or Jeff's own pages. And even I, I mean, I knew that there were a heck of a lot of people out there whose lives Jeff had literally changed. He had literally made their lives better, not just because they ran a six or seven-hour marathon, whatever it was, but because he taught them to believe in themselves themselves and to believe that they could do other things as well as running and and marathoning. And uh I think, you know, there was a period early in the the growth of the Galloway run-walk-run uh group showing up at various races where I think people made fun of them and they were scorned completely, completely wrongly, because of course the roads are big enough and wide enough to accommodate all of us, particularly with today's digital technology. But it wasn't easy to, it's never easy for anyone to hear criticism of the work he's doing or the people he's coaching. But boy, I think that's really faded away over the last 10 or 15 years, and people recognize that the incredible, wonderful growth of running and especially marathoning, a big, big piece of that is due to Jeff Galloway. And it's due to Jeff's effect on single individual human beings, one after another after another, one clinic after another after another, one talk, one email, one uh whatever he was doing. He communicated in so many ways. The books, of course. He got the message out there in a lot of different ways, and people took it uh and they achieved things that they never thought possible. And Jeff, way, way, way more than anyone else, was responsible for that significant growth of uh recreational runners. Wow.

SPEAKER_13 29:34

And he treated us all as though we were members of his family.

SPEAKER_01 29:39

Because that's who he was, and that's what he believed, and that was the person he he was, and I never got to know his father or his mother well, but there must have been something really, really good going on in that family because they produced one heck of a son, and the uh various uh Georgia politicians that he looked up to through the years were all civil rights and human rights people. And uh I don't want to put Jeff on a realm with some of them like a Jimmy Carter, but in his own in his own realm, he was doing the same kinds of work and he was doing it extraordinarily well.

SPEAKER_09 30:22

Do you think Jeff helped redefine who belongs in the sport?

SPEAKER_01 30:26

Yes, he did. Uh there have been several redefinitions of who belongs in the sport in my long career uh as a runner. First, uh, of course, we had to accept women. That took a long time, but that began to happen. Uh, and it really took off in in the mid-1990s. Uh, one thing that happened then was Oprah Winfrey ran a marathon, and that had a huge effect. But you know, it was also a time when Jeff was really getting out there weekend after weekend after weekend. And of course, his his message resonated with women who, in particular, not having athletic uh prior years in high school or college, might not have believed they could do something athletic. And Jeff said, yes, you can. And boy, has the women's running growth been stupendous. Older runners, uh, which we all are now, but there were not that many of them 30 or 40 years ago, was another massive increase and a wonderful thing in the sport, and a great example to younger runners that they can keep going and be vibrant in their later years. And then, you know, in the middle of it all, in the middle of the mix was was Jeff, because he supported all of those things. He supported everything that was right in running for all groups of people. There was no one that Jeff didn't want to help. There was no one he didn't want to get into running, there was no one who who he said, no, you can't do this. Uh it's not right for you. You're too overweight, or you're too this, or you never played basketball or soccer in high school, so how can how can you run? Jeff never said that. He said the opposite, and he brought out the best in people, and that was a huge contribution.

SPEAKER_09 32:18

And do you think that's why Jeff's message resonated strongly with beginners when the running culture was, let's say, hardcore back then?

SPEAKER_01 32:27

Oh, absolutely. I mean, beginners have so many hurdles to overcome. One, beginning running is just plain hard. It's difficult. It doesn't come easy for anyone unless maybe you're a skinny 18-year-old in high school. But, you know, the midlife runners who, let's face it, have been uh non-runners, I should say, who've been leading a sedentary life for 20 or 30 years and probably put on a few dozen pounds along the way. There's absolutely nothing easy about beginning running. And you can get so discouraged and so turned off and so depressed so quickly, unless you have someone telling you, wait another week, wait another month, I know it's not going great now, but guess what? It's gonna change. You're gonna reach a point where you start to become comfortable with your own running. And Jeff and I and Bill, and none of us ever promised someone they were gonna qualify for Boston or make it onto the Olympic team. That's not the point. The point is that if you stick with it with just a good stern dose of determination, give it time, believe in yourself, let your body adapt. Things will change, and running will get different and a little bit easier, uh, and you'll certainly start to feel the benefits from it. And again, nobody gave that message as long, as consistently, as passionately, and as strongly felt as Jeff. And he did it every day and every weekend and every month for decade after decade.

SPEAKER_13 34:11

Surely did. Andy, when when people talk about Jeff decades from now, and I believe they will, what do you hope they remember the most?

SPEAKER_01 34:19

I hope they remember that he was a giving man, that he enjoyed his life, he enjoyed his family, he enjoyed his own running and his own fitness, and and most important of all, he was one of those rare and lucky individuals who determined exactly what his role in life, exactly what his passion was, and he followed through on it, and he kept at it, and he did it better and longer than anyone else.

SPEAKER_13 34:52

Wonderful. What's the best way for us to carry his legacy forward?

SPEAKER_01 34:57

Uh to keep encouraging people to begin running, uh, to adapt their running. I'm Jeff's age, I'm 79 and a half now, and I've been run-walking for the last 20 years of my running career. And each year, you know, the ratio changes. I started out run-walking 20 years ago. I was going nine minutes and then of running and one minute of walking, and then the last 10 years, 15 have been four minutes of running and one walking. Last year at Boston was three and one. Boston or two from now, it'll be just two minutes and one. But by adapting, I uh I keep my energy and excitement, and I stay out there and I do all the things that make running so healthy for you. So uh you've got to adapt, uh, you've got to believe, you have to understand that run, walk, run is truly infinitely flexible, and you can take it in any direction you want at any time in your life, injured or peaking for a marathon, and uh it can work for you.

SPEAKER_13 36:05

Fantastic. Andy, it's been an absolute pleasure to talk to you. I wish it was under different circumstances, but gosh, thank you so much for joining us and helping to celebrate Jeff's life and legacy.

Bill Rogers On Kindness And Joy

SPEAKER_01 36:18

Well, thank you for the invitation. It it is a great pleasure to speak about Jeff and all that he contributed to the sport we all love so much, and the sport that we believe is big enough to uh offer open arms and a big umbrella to all of us. We miss Jeff dearly. I miss him more, I think, than I knew or expected uh I would because I never expected uh his passing so soon. But um it is an honor and it also is very important to let people know about everything Jeff did accomplish in his life, not for himself, but for everyone else he came in contact with. Caution runners, change of topic ahead.

SPEAKER_13 37:08

Our next guest is one of the true legends of our sport, known to many as Boston Billy. He's a four-time champion of both the Boston Marathon and the New York City Marathon, and someone whose name will forever be a part of running history. But beyond these victories and the records, he's also someone who shared an era and a deep connection with our friend Jeff. We're honored to have him with us to help remember Jeff Galloway and celebrate the impact he made on all of us. Bill Rogers, welcome to our special episode of the Rise and Run podcast, and thank you for joining us.

SPEAKER_11 37:48

Thank you very much, Bob. It's an honor to be here to talk about Jeff. I've known him a long time, you know. Sometimes I'd see him, sometimes I didn't see him. He he was like a will-o-wisp, you know.

SPEAKER_13 38:01

He was everywhere.

SPEAKER_11 38:02

He's everywhere. What was really cool is I got to see him at the Disney Marathon this past January. Oh, did you? I was down there, you know, all of us these days work with fundraising groups and everything that's a huge part of our sport, you know, kind of the same spirit as Jeff Galloway had. And I was down there with a doctor friend of mine I've worked with 10 or 15 years with my partner Karen, and we're gonna run the uh uh 10K. We were way at the back and everything. And I Karen had trouble getting her number. And finally, someone at the race recognized me and everything, you know, and and and we walked all through the expo looking for Jeff, you know. I didn't know if he'd even be there because I knew he had hurt himself. He had fallen.

SPEAKER_13 38:48

Yeah, he'd crack that kneecap, yeah.

SPEAKER_11 38:50

Yeah, so we're walking out of the expo, and there's a guy sitting on the side of the wall eating his lunch. He says, Bill. And he was Mike was his name, a longtime Jeff Galloway employee. Anyway, um, he brought us back in. There's Jeff and Barbara at the booth. We hugged. It was very intense because I hadn't seen him in a number of years and everything. But um, you know, I I knew Jeff some at Wesleyan University when I was a freshman, he was a senior. And and uh and Ambi, of course, was the crank out guy, but Jeff was our miler 800-meter guy. He had some speed, you know. And uh, but but the next time after graduation, it was that very tough time in American life, you know, the Vietnam War, which actually was uh his dad was a military guy, and I know Jeff was on a boat in Vietnam. And um, but then he he he I don't know the complete connection, but suddenly it seems I think he was at a university teaching courses about running, and he realized you know that if I walk, I recover pretty pretty good, you know. And I saw this in action too, Jeff's um way of reaching out to people. We were in Hopkinton at this near the start of the Buy Marathon, he was going to do a focus, you know, about how to run Boston, smart, careful, you know, with his method. And we went into a pizza shop with honoring pizza and everything. And and the next thing you know, um Jeff is talking to people, complete strangers. And they say, Are you here for about the marathon? You know, the Boston Marathon Starline and all this. Jeff says, Well, I I've run a lot of marathons. I I can teach you to run the marathon. Next thing you know, because Jeff had a huge heart.

SPEAKER_13 40:49

You know. You said strangers. I didn't think Jeff knew any strangers.

SPEAKER_11 40:53

This this is a completely, you know, off the wall thing, but he made friends quick.

SPEAKER_13 40:58

Yeah, he sure did. He sure did. Do you remember what your first impression of him was? You said uh he was a senior, you were a freshman.

SPEAKER_11 41:06

Yes. And um I only knew that he was he had a record or two at Westland and he was fast and he was so friendly. He actually helped me with a geology exam once. I wasn't the greatest student at Westland, but um Jeff was a smart guy and he's he's like willing to help anybody. Years later, when I had become a stronger runner, actually I saw Jeff finish Boston after I was I had quit running, I was smoking my cigarette standing at the finish line because I was living at a different time, right? I had moved to Boston, I was a conscientious subjector, and I worked in the hospital for two years, and um learned a lot there. But my teammate, roommate Jason, uh, and I walked over to the Boston Marathon finish line. We had never, you know, it wasn't on TV in those days.

SPEAKER_13 42:00

Right, not back then, no.

SPEAKER_11 42:04

Either one of those years, and I saw Jeff finish and other people I ran against in my college days, and I was like, holy cow, and I had my cigarettes here and everything. It took me a while. I had to get knocked down even more before I would get back to running, you know. But Jeff um was always friendly, and years later he brought me down to Peachtree, which he was a founder of the Peachtree Road, it's one of our country's great races. And um and he invited me over his house, and next thing you know, I'm eating grits, you know. He really wanted me to get a feel, you know, for Atlanta and and and what his life was like, and then I learned about the Galloway school and I understood Jeff more. I understood him, you know, and he's a teacher, and and that's what he is, and he is teaching running, marathon. And but he was not just your average coach, you know, in a certain sense, though. I don't know if any coach is really average, but teaching the marathon is a different deal, I think. You know what I mean. This long haul distance, and and then I came down another time later when I was a bit older to Jeff Galloway's half marathon in Atlanta, where we finished in the park, Piedmont Park, and um and I remember I was at a booth or something, and I saw the woman walking around looking to sign up or something. I forget how I met her, but she had cystic fibrosis. I thought you are something, you know. But this is the way Jeff was. He he just had a great ability to speak to people, and you know, that that was unparalleled, I think, really.

SPEAKER_13 43:51

Oh, I I couldn't agree more. I mean I was honored to have several conversations with him, some of them kind of on that subject. And One of the quotes I've shared with our friends many times is he would turn to me and said, Bob, you can't fake that. It's got to come from within. And it surely did in his case.

SPEAKER_02 44:10

Bill, you you shared a lot of wonderful stories and a lot of beautiful characteristics about you know the Jeff Galloway that you knew. But if you could pinpoint it down to one thing, what is the one thing that you respected the most about Jeff? Kindness.

SPEAKER_13 44:28

That's kindness. That's a good one. It certainly was.

SPEAKER_11 44:33

He he was, and I also think Jeff was having so much fun. He really loved reaching out to people. And even when he was down there with a knee brace on at his booth, he was getting up off his chair and standing there, and he had around 25 people around him, you know, and it probably went. I don't know. Jeff was just a he was a different breed of cat, you know, and he was a special person. We all miss him. There's only one Jeff Galloway. I'm glad I know him. One time I was in Alaska with Jeff. And I tried to do the run walk. I was about 50 years old then, 52 or something, but I couldn't restrain myself.

SPEAKER_08 45:26

Okay.

SPEAKER_11 45:27

But today I have to run walk because I'm older, you know, the whole deal. So I think it's a psychological thing, depending where you're coming from. You know, and if you're a brand new runner, I think you need a lot of support. You need a lot of support, and someone who believes in you is powerful. It's everything. That's what that's what Jeff understood. And he, you know, ran a marathon as a young guy in Atlanta and everything. And and and of course, there was a connection with Ambie Burfoot. And so those two I think were major figures in our sport as teachers, you know. And and uh but I don't know, Amby's follows kind of a Galloway system today. But Barbara, I remember seeing her with Jeff a long time ago. And sometimes I often I was wondering, well, is is this is is she really for real? You know, I mean there are a couple and everything, you know what I'm saying. And and but it turns out she was for real. And then I I because I more recently read stories, you know, but I'd see her them together always for decades and decades. And that's a great story right there.

SPEAKER_13 46:46

She would hang with him at the Disney events. In fact, I was uh fortunate. The last time I saw Jeff was late in January out in California, and he was doing much better. Spirits were up, physically he was feeling better, but I never asked Jeff how he felt. I'd always asked Barbara how Jeff felt because I knew she'd give me the truth, the true story.

SPEAKER_11 47:09

Yeah, I think that was true. I think Barbara helped Jeff tremendously, and you know, their sons, you know, they're runners, they were involved with Disney. You know, Jeff made the Disney Marathon. He made it. Um, the spirit of the Disney Marathon, you know, and and and and and what running really is, and and all the it's a fun sport.

SPEAKER_13 47:33

It can be hard, it can be tough. Those are both true, absolutely.

SPEAKER_11 47:37

For everyone, but but Jeff made it fun for everyone, and and I like that.

SPEAKER_13 47:41

You know, you knew Jeff as an elite competitor, and you also knew him as this guy who helped everybody. Did it surprise you that he made that trans? I don't even know if it was a transition. Maybe he always had it in him.

SPEAKER_11 47:53

I think he always had it in him, but I think he had to go, you know, he made the Olympic team and everything. He helped his friend Jack Bachelor, the team that struggle. You know, it's just it's just incredible. Jeff's story is like it should be a movie, I think, you know. And um, but he was uh he gave so much, you know, and uh I think you know, you're 80 years old, you're getting older, father time is there for all of us, and Mother Nature. And I think Jeff pushed himself hard. He pushed himself hard. And uh, but I think he had a great, great life. That's what I believe.

SPEAKER_13 48:35

You know, and we'll we'll get to his legacy here in a minute, okay? I love you. You mentioned Jack Batchel. I love the story Jeff would tell how the two of them came into the arena with only one spot left on the Olympic team, and the crowds were going crazy. But the two of them knew who was going to get the spot. Nobody else knew, but they did.

SPEAKER_11 48:54

It's like, I mean, a fair number of people must know the story, but most people can't really can you comprehend this? An Olympic spot, these are rarities, you know, and uh, but they're friends, and this is a friendship sport, really, and that's what Jeff really knew. And you know, I was with Jeff and Kree Kelly at, I believe it was his half marathon race, and we were talking to a bunch of runners, and Jeff spoke up and said, you know, when you're out there, um, remember the people see you out there. So you're you're affecting all these other people who are watching races, and a lot of them are saying, I wish I could do it. I wonder if I could do it. Could I do the 10K? Can I do a 5K? Can I run? You know, and and Jeff was the greatest believer in that. And he had he just had this great heart, you know. He was different.

SPEAKER_09 49:51

Run walk one method. A lot of runners got started running with the run walk one method. What did you think when you first saw the impact he was having on new runners?

SPEAKER_11 50:01

You know, I I loved it. I loved that Jeff was was having fun. He was having a great life, you know, and helping all these other people, you know, and changing our sport. Because our sport, when you look at it from the old days of the marathon, you know, the Boston Marathon, there'd be 18 guys there, you know, something like that, and very little knowledge of how we should train, how we can train to improve and and have a better race, you know. Jeff understood all of that because he went through the steps himself, high school, college, and and post-collegiate and rip made the Olympic team. So he understood everything, he understood physiology, but I think his major strength was that he um he liked people, you know, and and that's you know, to be able to take that step and give a lot all your time and your energy that's a lot. That's a lot. And he did that his whole life, you know, until he was eight years old. And um, so I think he's a to me, Jeff is an American champion, capital letters, A and C. That's how it I I I have always felt that the sport of athletics, you know, is is one of the great sports in the world. You know, this is the way I think. I'm kind of like Jeff at that point.

SPEAKER_13 51:18

Certainly understand, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 51:20

So, Bill, you've you've mentioned stories, you know, from all your travels with Jeff and obviously your time at Wesleyan as well. But if do you have a favorite memory of him, a memory that really captured who he was, not just as a runner, but more importantly as a person?

SPEAKER_11 51:37

Yeah, yeah. Well, we were friends. So, so that meant a lot to me, you know. And um, and when I found him at the booth, we were shocked. And my partner Karen had never met Jeff Galloway. She'd met never met Jeff or or Barbara, his wife. And we hugged each other, you know, and uh that's for real. So I I'm proud to say Jeff was my friend, you know, and and Karen and Barbara got along, and Barbara was inviting us to Destin to visit them at their place in Florida and everything, you know. And um I just loved uh the way Jeff lived, you know. He he was a good guy, in every sense of the word, a good person. And he I don't know, you can't say anything bad about Jeff Callaway.

SPEAKER_13 52:28

No, no, no. No, no.

SPEAKER_11 52:30

Who who would? Who could?

SPEAKER_13 52:32

No, I don't think anybody could.

SPEAKER_11 52:33

Yeah, he he was really someone different.

SPEAKER_13 52:37

Any moments maybe he ever caught you off guard or made you laugh?

SPEAKER_11 52:41

Well, you know, he always made me laugh in a certain way. Once he came up to our store in Boston, you know, he said, Well, can I come up to a store and meet with runners? And I said, Of course, you know, me and my brother Charlie called a running shoe store. And uh and we came up there, and Jeff he was doing cranking out, you know. But Jeff was funny, he was a fanatic about power bars. He loved to eat his power bars. When the power bars came on the scene, you know, they're pretty tasty. I liked them too. But I think Jeff he learned everything he could about the sport, you know, the best diet you might want to eat, how to run smart. Because running smart is hard. It's really, really hard. I know because I've failed at a lot. I've dropped out of eight marathons, and I've had others where I really got beaten up because I didn't run smart. It's really hard to run smart. So if you could create a plan for people, I'm talking to a doctor friend of mine, she's a new runner, she's like 55 years old or something, and becoming a runner. And I told her, Do you know have you Jeff Galloway? You gotta get his book. So I've always believed in Jeff, you know. And um he he I don't know if anyone can really say I think his number one thing that he he had a big heart, you know. It was fun to meet him again. And it just was just like it was 20 years ago, 30 years ago. We're teammates, you know. Teammates. When you think about Jeff's legacy, uh, what stands out the most to you? That he reached so many people in such a good way, you know, and he uh he'll always be remembered for that. His legacy, his life will live on and for ever because it's was something something so different. He opened the door for so many people to believe in themselves because that's the toughest thing. Does someone ever believe in you in your potential of what you might be able to do as a person? Jeff had that. He must have gotten it from his dad and mom. Mom's count too, big time. And um and then he met Barbara, and then Jeff was set, I think. And uh, you know, he he he he he was just on a mission, literally, you know, and uh and he succeeded. And and uh we all care about Jeff, everyone. But then he reached so many people is beyond belief. I don't know if you've talked with Ambi about Jeff. You know, when Jeff was a junior, Amby was a freshman at Wesleyan. And Westland is this kind of a school where you're kind of winging it a little bit, you know, you have to sink or swim a little, and uh kind of a tough school academically and everything. And but they both had dreams. And Ambi's came from um his coach, Johnny Kelly, the younger, who made our Olympic team twice, competed in the marathon, and won the Boston Marathon in 1957. And I think Jeff's came uh from his family, you know. That's all I can think, you know. He was this kind of out of shape young kid as a kid, you know, but he found his path. You just got to find your path. Once you find it, and everyone's got potential somewhere and some skill or ability. I I just am a big believer in that. And um, and that's what Jeff talked to people about, you know, you can do this.

Chris Twiggs On Coaching Torch Passing

SPEAKER_12 56:18

Caution runners, the topic is about to change right now.

SPEAKER_13 56:24

Friends, our next guest is no stranger to the Rise and Run Podcast. Chris Twiggs has been with us. Gosh, as probably as many times as as anyone, maybe with the exception of Jeff, but I think they're right up there together. But it while it's been fun talking with Andy and Dean and Bill from back in Jeff's competitive days, I've asked Chris to join us to talk a bit about learning about Jeff Galloway, the coach, and getting involved with him early. And well, Chris, thanks for joining us.

SPEAKER_15 56:57

Yeah, it's absolutely my pleasure to be here anytime, but especially uh with the opportunity to talk about Jeff Galloway.

SPEAKER_13 57:04

Yeah, we all feel the same way. We all kind of wish we weren't here, but but that's it's true. Yeah. Uh so listen, let me just simply ask, how did all this get started? How did you get to when did you meet Jeff and how did you get involved with his uh training development program?

SPEAKER_15 57:23

Yeah, yeah. So I met Jeff probably the way that millions of people did, which was through his books. And uh really at the time that I started reading Jeff, uh, he only had one book out. It was Galloway's book on running. It was the best-selling running book of its time. And this would have been 1993 or 94. 90, it would have been 93, because I had not yet run my first marathon, which would be the 1994 Walt Disney World Marathon. Uh, so I bought his book before I ran that first marathon, but I didn't use it to train for that first one. I was using a different book. My wife and I were using a different book, but we already knew there was something missing in that other book. We already knew we didn't like the training schedule in the other book as much, but we'd already ridden that horse halfway across a stream. We weren't gonna change horses there. So we continued with that first one, but we knew if and when we did a second marathon, we would use Jeff's plan. And so we did. We, once we started training for that second marathon, which admittedly was several months after finishing the first, I didn't run a step for about three months after my first marathon. Um, but then we read Jeff's book cover to cover. We followed the training schedule. Uh, we really loved everything about it. We loved the fact that in that book, Jeff was talking to us like we were regular people who had regular jobs and regular lives and still wanted to do this amazing thing of running a marathon. And that was what was different about Jeff Galloway's book on running from the other book we had used and from other books of its time. Other books might have been written by and were written by Olympians and, you know, big name runners, but they basically were taking schedules that would work for elites and toning them down a little bit. And that's not what Jeff's did. Jeff's took what a regular person's life entailed and figured out how to get the most out of our training time. And I really needed that. I appreciated that. When we were training for my our first marathon, we'd just gotten married. I was working three jobs and in grad school. So I didn't have extra time. And so Jeff's plan was perfect. And then the first time we met him would have been the 1995 Walt Disney World Marathon. He was there as a speaker, and we were excited to go and listen to him, to him, and hear him talk about everything. And that was the first time we heard about walk breaks. And they were in that first book, but we kind of skipped over those pages. We didn't really pay attention to those pages. And he was emphasizing the need for walk breaks, and we decided to try it. We decided to take him at his word that they would work. And obviously they did. And I've told you that story before. My wife qualified for Boston in that first run that we ever took with walk breaks. And so then the I don't remember if I actually had a conversation with Jeff there. It was a, you know, it was a big space. They don't do that this as much at marathons anymore, but they used to have speakers and people would would crowd into seats to listen to folks. And um, so not as often do they do that anymore, but we we were doing that back then. And so I don't remember if I got to ask Jeff any questions that first time. But then uh the next that fall uh in October, we ran the Marine Corps marathon. And it just so happened Jeff was on the same shuttle bus from the airport to or from the hotel to the airport that we were on. And so we had him to ourselves basically. And he had come out with another book at that point, and I bought it immediately, and I read through most of it that night before the Marine Corps marathon. And so I asked him some questions in that bus and then offered my assistance because he he knew that that book was not as good as it could have been. It was something a little bit experimental. It was kind of a great idea that wasn't fully fleshed out, and so I offered to help him. I was an English professor at the time, and that was how the relationship began. And so I started uh helping him with some of his writing projects. And then through his books and conversations with him, I got to know his plan as as well as anybody. And then I he invited me to start my own Galloway training program. And I remember the first Galloway training program, uh, program directors meeting that I went to. And it was an in-person meeting in Atlanta. And our son, who was born in January of 1998, was probably two weeks old when we went to this. And somewhere around here, I know I have a picture of Jeff Galloway holding uh Wesley when he was just an infant. Um so my kids have known, yeah, my kids have known the Galloways their entire lives. And um, you know, I've worked for Jeff full-time since 2010, but that that relationship started back in uh January of 1995.

SPEAKER_09 1:02:32

Jeff became synonymous with Run Disney. What made that partnership so special to him?

SPEAKER_15 1:02:39

Well, Jeff was part of the Disney races before Run Disney existed. And that began because of John Hughes, the owner of Track Shack. John and Betsy Hughes owned Track Shack, and they were the ones that brought athletics, brought athletic events to Walt Disney World. And so when John and Betsy were putting together that first Walt Disney World Marathon, they invited Jeff to come and be a part of that. And so Jeff was there from the beginning of that experience. And so as Run Disney was created and as the events got added, the half marathon, and then the goofy, and then the 10K and 5K, and the dopey, and all the California races and all the other race uh weekends, Jeff was just kind of there when before all that happened and became a part of it from the beginning. And I remember one of the other relationships that he had for a long time was with a tour company in Greece. And he would go and run the Athens Marathon, which is an amazing event. I highly recommend it. And I remember Disney added a new race in California. I don't remember which one it was, the Avengers half or one of those. And it fell on the same weekend as the Athens Marathon. And I remember Jeff saying to Disney, Well, you don't really need me for that one, right? Because I've got this other thing over here. And he said, No, no, no, no, no. You're here for all of our races. You're in, no exception. Yeah, no exception. So they they as as much fun as he had with Disney from the beginning, they became very reliant on Jeff. They wanted him, they would needed him there every single race weekend. And um I think Princess that just passed was the first Disney weekend that he missed of any of the races that ever happened.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:28

You know, Chris, speaking of Athens, obviously something that, you know, is symbolic about Athens is you know the Olympic Games. And one thing that with any Olympic Games that anyone knows is the passing of the torch in lighting the Olympic flame. But in looking at your relationship with Jeff, I would have to imagine that there is a sense of torch passing where I mean, sure, he was your employer, but obviously he was a mentor and inadvertently coached you, you know, after you were reading all those books and such, and now you coach so many of us. Is there a a motto or something that Jeff believed that every time you impart your wisdom onto us, in the back of your mind, you're always thinking about Jeff because that came from Jeff or that was inspired by Jeff?

SPEAKER_15 1:05:27

Yeah, I absolutely. Accomplishments that you have, these, whether it's a faster magic mile or your first half marathon or a PR, whatever it is, first multi-day event, these are your accomplishments. You did these things. And if you're training for these things and you haven't done them yet, you are going to do these things. And yes, I love when people thank me. We all like being thanked for different things. But what I saw happen to Jeff again and again and again, and what I'm experiencing myself through the runners that I coach is that while we may be thanked for the stuff that we're doing, we're sincere. And Jeff was always sincere in saying, you did this. Jeff didn't do it for you. He just believed in you and encouraged you and maybe nudged you in the right direction with some of the coaching. But the accomplishments are your accomplishments. And I don't ever want to take credit for what an athlete has done that I've coached. I don't deserve any credit. Uh the athlete deserves the credit. Now, I feel I feel bad if someone misses a goal and I might feel a little, I might take a little bit of blame on myself that may or may not be warranted. Um, but I always want the athletes to understand that they deserve the credit for their accomplishments. They did these things. And something that I say, I'm not sure I heard Jeff say it, but something that I say that I I think is inspired by Jeff is that I'm your biggest fan. I'm absolutely your biggest fan. I'm the person who is out there cheering the loudest for you because I believe in you and I'm excited about you, and I know the goals that you have, and I know the challenges that you have if I'm coaching you. And so when you accomplish things, or even if you just barely miss, but you you've given it your best, I am proud of you and and I'm excited for that. So I'm your biggest fan. Jeff Galloway was your biggest fan. Um, and that's the spirit that I believe that I've gotten from Jeff. And it and, you know, maybe it's maybe it's that I don't I wouldn't say that Jeff ever taught me to do that. I think Jeff recognized that in me and um and and brought me in uh and encouraged that and nurtured that. And I'm uh I'm I'm humbled that I get to work uh in this company and I'm humbled that I get to do this job. And I'm deeply saddened that I don't have my my mentor around anymore to help with that. But I've learned so much from him, and um, and I'm just trying my best to impart that to others. And I love it when I'm I'm on these customized calls and I hear people encouraging each other, or like last week I had to miss the calls because I was traveling and I listened to them later, and I'm hearing Sherry, um, or I'm hearing Stephanie or I'm hearing anybody else give encouragement to each other and say, well, I think what Chris would say is this. And you're usually right because people are listening, and it's not, you know, this isn't rocket science. We're not curing cancer here. We're having fun with a sport, but it matters because it's bringing us together and it's keeping us healthy, and it's a gift we're giving to our children, our grandchildren, uh, to keep us healthy and keep us around. So, I mean, I I I could go on and on, but these are all things that I think Jeff has um empowered me to do and enabled me to do, and I'm excited to continue doing it.

SPEAKER_13 1:09:29

I don't know if Jeff ever used those words, I'm your biggest fan. I if he didn't, he certainly embodied it. He certainly made us feel that way. So I'm with you.

SPEAKER_15 1:09:49

Wow. Um there's so there's so many sides to Jeff Galloway. Um but but I mean I think I've told you this. I've certainly talked about this in some of the of the customized calls. Something that I'm sorry that more people didn't get to see was uh several years ago, Jeff and I traveled to Beijing, China to work with a bunch of coaches over there. And it was a it was a long project. They translated uh one of his books into their language. Uh they had um they had all the these coaches uh gathered in in Beijing to hear to work with us for a couple of days. We had a translator that went with us that that came from from Atlanta with us that uh as Jeff and I would talk to these coaches. But but what's amazing is here we are on the other side of the world, and the the crowds that you see at Run Disney, those are the same sorts of crowds that we had in Beijing. All of these people, many of them not able to speak English, but they were so excited to meet Jeff. They were so excited to learn from Jeff. And and a lot of these folks that we had in the classroom with us were coaches, and so they're learning his method to help teach it to the people there, um never went to his head, absolutely never went to his head. Um, but it was just this amazing openness and willingness to help anyone. The Bird's Nest, which is the big um stadium there in Beijing. We had dinner in this in this stadium, in this like club that's in the stadium that overlooks the track. And I don't even want to imagine what it would normally take to get, probably there's no way you could anybody could get into that. But Jeff opened all doors, right? So so we with our hosts, we had we had this meeting there and this amazing experience there, and we got to go down to the track as well. And none of it ever went to his head. He was always open and excited to help people. And what he saw was that this running stuff, it crosses all barriers of nationality, it crosses all barriers of ethnicity, it crosses all barriers of politics and religion and and all of those things. It's something that that feeling that we have when we're running, it's universal. And the love, the passion that we have for our sport is something that we share with runners all over the world. People will never meet, people we can never communicate with, but we can have that experience uh together out there on on a run, or even if you're not in the same place sometimes, uh as we know from the communities that we have. So um, you know, that that joy that I saw in Jeff and the joy that I saw of those people getting to be there um and meet Jeff was just um I if I could if I could go back and spend one more day with Jeff Galloway, one of those days in Beijing is one that I would choose.

SPEAKER_13 1:13:08

Wow. For what it's worth, Chris, that was a special day to Jeff. He told us about it the last time he was with us. And and it's the same attitude, you know, the same how much he loved it and all that.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:19

So, coach, obviously Jeff had a lasting impact on all of us in so many ways, whether again, it's through his literature, through his talks, through just you know, the high fives and the fist bumps, you know, on the rail, you know, as we're coming in on the final stretch of a Run Disney course. But what's one part of Jeff's legacy that you think not just the Run Disney community, but the running world hasn't fully appreciated yet?

SPEAKER_15 1:13:47

Well, I think Jeff's legacy is the openness and the um the acceptance, the accessibility that the to the running community um I I I don't think I think without Jeff Galloway, we don't have the same uh type of people doing Run Disney events. We don't have the same type of people running the world majors. I think without Jeff Galloway, running is a spectator sport. And that's that's Jeff's legacy is that running is not a spectator sport. Running is an is an all-comers experience. And there the doors are wide open, there's no barrier to entry. Anyone can do it. You don't have to be a certain speed, you don't have to go a certain distance. If you can run for 30 seconds, you're a runner. If you can run for 15 seconds, you're a runner. So uh that's uh that's the thing. That's the thing that I think is Jeff Galloway's legacy.

SPEAKER_12 1:14:48

Caution runners, change of topic ahead.

SPEAKER_13 1:14:53

As we conclude this tribute to Jeff, we wanted to spend some time with the people who knew him best. Not as a coach, not as an Olympian, not as a legend in our Run Disney World, but as a father and a member of a family who deeply loved him. So much of what Jeff gave to the running community came from who he was. His kindness, his generosity, the way he made every single person feel like they mattered. And those qualities all started at home. We're incredibly grateful to be joined by Jeff's son Weston and his daughter-in-law Carissa, names you probably know from the Run Disney World. We're asking them to share some of their memories, their stories, and a little bit about what made Jeff so special. Weston, Carissa, welcome back to the podcast. Thanks so much for spending some time with us. Thank you for having us.

SPEAKER_14 1:15:47

Yeah, it's always good to be with you guys, and just you guys are doing such an awesome job. So thank you for doing this for Jeff, but thank you for everything you guys do for the community.

SPEAKER_13 1:15:55

Well, you are welcome, of course, and you know, you know, I know you know, I know both of you know how much Jeff meant Jeff meant to us and to me personally. But let me kick this off. We all knew Jeff as a coach and a mentor. Who was he at home?

SPEAKER_03 1:16:12

Well, I think it's also it's kind of funny when you were going through, you know, what people know him as, and I knew him as all those things too. Um, you know, he was our kind of volunteer assistant in high school uh for the track and cross-country team. All right, that's neat. And then he was uh obviously whenever I had a race, he was he was my coach, but um he was my mentor, he was my business partner, he was my uh talent when I had to direct him on awkward social media videos and such. Um but yeah, there there were a lot of different uh different things that different roles that we we played, if you will.

SPEAKER_14 1:16:58

I was laughing because I'm already going off track because for years at Run Disney, and whenever Riley and John listen to this, they're gonna crack up, we'd have to remind him. And he finally got it, that like when I ask you a question, look at the camera. Don't look at because he wants to look at you when he answers. So for years, I'd ask him something on stage and he'd look into my eyes and tell me the answer, and I'd be like, Jeff, please. Yeah, John and Riley are laughing because you know, after the last five years or something, they'd be like, he's got it, he's got it.

SPEAKER_13 1:17:26

Now, Weson, you talked about videos. Were you the director of Do the Galloway?

SPEAKER_03 1:17:31

No, we actually I didn't have anything to do with that. I was, I think I was at A6 at the time, and and he was he was excited about the opportunity. He was very um so it was right after he had broken his hip, and he there was he broke his hip doing another video project, um, running up some stairs and tripped on the last stair. But um he was excited about the opportunity, but definitely didn't want to do any dancing. They were trying to get him to dance, and he uh I don't know, refused is the right word, but he uh did did not partake. But some of it, or he at least blamed it on the hip. Uh but yeah, so it's yeah, wasn't it?

SPEAKER_14 1:18:12

Mark Ferreira, our current director, is was in Haynes and all of those kinds of things. So even back then, but that's a good one.

SPEAKER_13 1:18:18

Okay. Yeah. Hey, if friends, if you don't know what I'm talking about, look it up. It's on YouTube. Do the Galloway.

SPEAKER_14 1:18:24

Do the Galloway.

SPEAKER_13 1:18:25

Do the Galloway.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:26

And he got to talk with Mickey Mouse. It was very serious. It might it might make sense.

SPEAKER_06 1:18:30

He sure did.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:32

We'll see. But uh no, but but at home, I mean he was the same guy that that everyone knew really. Um, super laid back, super person-oriented. So I would say family-oriented, but but um but he he was a people person and he um spent a lot of time on his computer talking to people, uh, answering emails that he loved to do. Um he would he would get up early, go for his runner walk, and get a cup of coffee and start answering some emails. And then when we would come down the stairs, he would tell us about a lot of those emails that he got and and the e-coaching clients that were around and what they were up to and what they're you know. And a lot of times it would had nothing to do with running. It was, you know, about somebody's job or about, you know, some travel that they had done. Um, and so he was just he loved stories and loved people and loved sharing it with other people too. Um, but yeah, he was he was a normal guy. He loved going to the grocery store.

SPEAKER_14 1:19:40

You we asked Elliot today, what what do you remember about rum paw? And he was like, he loved the grocery store.

SPEAKER_13 1:19:47

And I love Run Pa as a grandpa name. That's pretty much.

SPEAKER_03 1:19:51

Yeah, that was a chosen name. Um, when my brother had his first, they were like thinking about what they were gonna be called, and he was like, I think I want to be called Rum Pa. That's Barb didn't really feel she didn't know how she felt about it. I bet she grew into it though. Yeah, yeah, I think it definitely fit.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:11

I I will say in all the times that I interacted with your dad, he always had a smile on his face. But what is something outside of say running in general or run Disney that your dad did that would always make you smile in just everyday life?

SPEAKER_03 1:20:33

I mean, the way that he interacted with with all the grandchildren, he he loved playing for as much as he could. Um playing with the grandchildren and reading them stories. We have some great videos of of him reading them, kind of their bedtime stories.

SPEAKER_14 1:20:53

He very animated it and he's like, and then he came up, you know, like he really was very present, you know, with them. And he never missed a story time. He never, you know, and even when it he wasn't reading, he just would sit there and rock. You know, we'd always gave him the best chair because he was the oldest. Except sometimes he would sit on the table and we were always afraid the table's gonna break, the little table. But um, he really liked being, he was very present with them. You know, sometimes, I mean, those of you who have kids and those listening of kids know that you're like playing and you're just like uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh. But he was the same present he was with people at the expo as he was, you know, playing with the kids.

SPEAKER_03 1:21:29

Yeah. And you said always had a smile on his face. There wasn't like a mean bone in his body.

SPEAKER_14 1:21:35

I mean, your whole did he ever yell at you your whole life?

SPEAKER_03 1:21:37

No, I I got I'm a disappointed, disappointed in you like once. But I think that was of uh I I just I had snuck in snuck out of the house.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:52

But let's be honest, it it's getting the I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed, is way worse than getting in trouble with it.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:01

Imagine you finish a race and he was like, No, definitely from a run standpoint, it was never that. But um, but when Claire started getting into gymnastics, I don't know how this came about.

SPEAKER_14 1:22:16

But Bebop is very creative and makes a lot of fun games, very good at make-believe.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:21

So yeah, my mom does a lot of so they're a perfect match because she is super creative. He is very pragmatic and uh uh a rule follower and a um a yes uh person, if you will. But they would they would play this game called Bad Judge, and uh Claire would do some gymnastics, and usually my mom would uh be very critical of the gymnastics. And she was little at this time.

SPEAKER_14 1:22:50

She wasn't like the level she is next to the show.

SPEAKER_03 1:22:52

She would, you know, whatever do a cartwheel. Oh, you could have done that so much better, and blah, blah, blah. Um, in a very funny way. And we're like, oh, you know, Runpa, can you can you be the bad judge? And he was like, Oh, okay. Um, and so she would do something, well, you it was very good. Um like he couldn't say anything bad. It was was quite funny because they they found more humor in that than actually being the bad judge because it was like him trying to be bad or angry, and he just couldn't couldn't find it. Yeah, that's wonderful.

SPEAKER_10 1:23:30

So, what would be your guys' actual like favorite non-run Disney or non-running memory that you guys have of him that maybe people may not have heard of so far?

SPEAKER_14 1:23:43

Um, so I went the wedding story. So when Weston and I got married, we did it in St. Croix, and it was a really small wedding because we'd been married before. And even when you get married for the first time, you don't need a million people there, right? You want the people just a PSA to people out there, and then maybe you're thinking about the first or second or third wedding. I don't know. Um, anyway, we had about 20 people, we had a big long dinner table, and it was outside in St. Croix, and there was a pool behind us, and after dinner, they were gonna move the table, and the pool was gonna be where like dancing and whatever is. So we somehow decided to like play telephone, and we kind of telephoned around the table to have everybody write on the back of their menu the first person who was gonna drink too much and fall on the pool. Everybody wrote it, put it down, whatever. Tables of women, we're having a good time, we're dancing. Jeff's gone, and all of a sudden, around the corner of the house comes Jeff, and he changed clothes and he runs and jumps right into the pool. Nobody on their video card had that Jeff Galloway would be these in the pool. But I have a picture of him jumping in the pool. I mean, and that's just how he he was silly. He did like to play practical jokes. I mean, and I can just, it was just the funniest thing. I was like, what's Jeff doing? And then at the end of the day, everybody had gone and some in their dresses, some not, and and ended up in the pool. And it was it was it was pretty fun.

SPEAKER_13 1:25:04

Uh that's great.

SPEAKER_14 1:25:06

Yeah, he he did play some jokes. There were some stories about him and Prefontaine and some practical jokes that some shenanigans that went on. So he might not have he might have not had a mean side, but he did have a silly, a silly side. Do you have a story?

SPEAKER_03 1:25:21

That's awesome. You got any more? Yeah. Let me think. Let me think. Well, just back back to that. So he um one of the like kind of not famous stories, but one that I had heard over and over again was um before there were cell phones, before there were car phones, um he had had put a phone in his car, and and he would he would pull up next to somebody or whatever and and and have the phone and say, Oh, I I think it's for you. It's for you. And and they'd be like, what in the world is going on? Um but but yeah, no, he so at Tahoe, I remember very vividly growing up, he would, we had this thing called the award ceremony. It was a very, you know, kind of funny award ceremony where people would give, you know, awards for people tripping on the trail or um, you know, doing funny things throughout the camp. Um and probably, you know, up until I don't know, 10 years ago, he would, before the award ceremony, he would go back to the room and put on just the craziest thing that he had. So, you know, one year it was like, and my mom would help him with this, but um, it was like newspapers, but like a peacock uh feathering um out behind him with an aqua jogger belt on and like just like crazy, crazy stuff. And it was very um entertaining to watch him walk into the room as this, and we all got a big, big kick out of it. But yeah, again, kind of the other side of Jeff that that doesn't uh get shown too much out there. Um, he had some voices that he would do. No good.

SPEAKER_14 1:27:13

Claire, he had a voice at dinner he would do sometimes that Claire really liked, and he would like do the whole thing where you turn your face and you come back and your face is different, and you alter ego. So yeah, you get into character. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_13 1:27:26

Wow.

SPEAKER_09 1:27:28

That's wonderful. A lot of us knew Jeff from the Run Disney Expos, and he treated us like family. Where did that come from?

SPEAKER_03 1:27:36

I think it came from his family. Um, so his there was like a long lineage of people in his family. His his grandfather, his father, um that did things to help people. Um and so his grandfather taught uh he he brought tobacco from North Carolina to South Georgia and taught farmers how to grow tobacco. And but he would go out in the fields and he would help help these farmers and help the people working the fields and really got to know these people and would have them over for um for dinner and and you know be part of their family. And I think you know that was ingrained in in my dad at a very young age. And then his father, um my my grandfather was a big people person and just loved everybody, wanted everybody to have a seat at the table, and um and in at the school that he opened, um he one of his famous stories was when Martin Luther King was was shot. Um Coretta Scott King wanted somewhere for her kids to go that was a safe place. And a lot of the private schools in Atlanta didn't want the king children to go there. And my my grandfather opened uh his arms to to the king children, and they uh I think two or three of them went to Galloway. And um it was just a very um the family was just super welcoming. Um and and so I think he he learned obviously through his upbringing um how to treat people and and you know what he wanted to do with his life and and saw what these people did with their life and helping others, and that's kind of you know what he wanted to continue in his own, obviously he put his own kind of spin on it. Um but I think you know, just the way he saw others being treated by his family, he he kept on kept that on. And like the way he would look you in the eye and and you felt like you were the only person in the room, and um, you know, that you your story truly mattered was because it it did truly matter to him. Um you know, you you could there's so many people that you know they're listening and you know that that okay, they do hear what I'm saying. Um, but he like really cared and then would, you know, tell us 10 of the stories that he heard at the expo um later that night or whatever. And so it was it was just his his caring nature.

SPEAKER_14 1:30:35

Um yeah, and I was thinking about that earlier about how you know in terms of running, he became who he was. And he started running, and we all know the story, but he started running because he had to, but then he kept running because he liked running. He didn't become an elite runner because he was a good runner. He actually liked running and he saw the benefits behind it. And so I think that's why when it came to, you know, run Disney and growing run, walk, run, he wasn't preaching running because he was a runner. He was preaching running because he knew even back then it changed your lives. So it was always like his, you know, in a way, religion. He was just sharing what he knew was to be true, and he knew nothing else truer than that. And I think that made him not only a good runner, but such a great coach because it was always genuine from the first time he went on a run. You know, and so I think that's why he wanted to hear the stories because he felt the same way. Everything you guys would say to him about being scared or what you were overcoming or your fears or your joys, like he'd lived them too, and he liked hearing that because it just reminded him of what beautiful things running brings to us.

SPEAKER_13 1:31:35

Well, so you mentioned Dr. King. One of my favorite stories Jeff tells is about how we met Dr. King in high school and the advice that Dr. King gave him going forward in life. You know the story I'm talking about?

SPEAKER_03 1:31:49

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he was, he was on the, it was at Wesleyan um in college, and he was on the welcoming committee. Um, he was actually involved with a lot of different things politically. And um when I hear this, I just wonder how he had time for for like was on you know some campaign trails and he was was on all these things. But um, but yeah, he was on this committee at Wesleyan, and so he got to tour Dr. King around the campus. And um, right before he was gonna give his speech, um, Jeff was standing next to him and he kind of mustered up the courage to ask him um, you know, what advice he would give to a soon-to-be out-of-college person uh for for what they wanted to do with their life. And so he said, you know, do something that helps improve the life of others. Um, and so he he took that and obviously literally ran with it. Um but it's funny uh when I was putting some thoughts together on on something that I would say at uh at Jeff's celebration, his dad would uh often say, find out who you are and become that person. And so it's kind of an interesting, like it's almost like he took that, but then he like helped people become even more than they thought they could be. So it was like an interesting lineage of uh of family.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:24

Weston, in that spirit, when you know the news you know was shared with the world of of Jeff's passing, what you guys wrote was just so uh incredibly impactful and powerful and truly honored you know your dad in so many different ways. But I I want to repeat one line from that you know statement. And and you guys wrote He is survived by every person who ever crossed a finish line and thought, uh I didn't think I could do this. Who came up with that incredibly powerful line?

SPEAKER_03 1:34:06

Um, I did. This idea of the the belief that he empowered people with that he knew something was in them that just by talking with him, he could kind of pull out of them. Um and and so we were trying to kind of you know play with that and how how do you um you know tie it in with some some running terminology, but but he yeah, had this unique ability to almost like um not con people, but like you know, you know, get them to believe in themselves when they didn't believe in themselves. Yes, that's right. And and that is is so powerful, and that's um definitely gonna go down as you know his legacy um and how other people can continue his legacy. But yeah, it it just you know, in in terms of that statement, we wanted to just find something that that kind of like you know said that.

SPEAKER_14 1:35:12

Um was inclusive because who he is is everybody that crossed the city. No, it was incredibly inclusive, yes. Is you know, that's as it's such a weird thing as we mourn so many people mourn their loss. Um and I think it was a good way to make sure people knew that like he loved you too.

SPEAKER_03 1:35:29

Yeah, oh yeah. Yeah, well, it it is a it is a funny, funny thing. I don't know if funny is the right word. Um, but you know, people say, you know, my condolences and and obviously we we feel that, but so many people had so many tight relationships and did feel like they were family with him. And so, you know, I always say I'm so sorry for your loss too, because you know, everybody felt that. And um we're all we're all in this together and we're all mourning, you know, his loss together.

SPEAKER_13 1:36:06

Without question. All right, I know this is this is a tough question, but what do you think you're gonna miss most about Jeff?

SPEAKER_14 1:36:15

I mean, me go first. Oh, that's so hard. It's just I mean, there's two sides of that. You know, one is that you always had someone you could turn to for advice. Um and for that pep talk that you needed. Um he always had something positive to say, and he always I've said this before, I said I think in one of my posts was that every time you left here, he would look at us separately and hug us and gotta hold our shoulders and say, I'm so proud of you. So I'm gonna miss that unselfishly. I'm gonna miss that my kids lost him. I'm gonna miss the impact he would have had on our kids' lives because Claire got to see so much of it. And we're so lucky that we got to spend so much time with him, and our kids did. Um, Elliot, even too, we just don't know, but I miss how much he would have made them believe in themselves. And I think that would have been such a beautiful gift, but they did get so much from him and they love him so so deeply. So I think if that's what I will I'll miss and I'll miss his salmon. He made a real I he made salmon really well. Oh, yeah. A lot of salt on it, like way more salt than I probably would have. Um, I'm gonna miss his salmon making ability.

SPEAKER_03 1:37:29

Yeah, potatoes and salmon.

SPEAKER_14 1:37:31

Potatoes and salmon he was quite good at. There you go. And he did the dishes, so he was good at that was also very nice.

unknown 1:37:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:37:36

Um, yeah, I mean, I he was like my um before Chat GPT, before really Googling anything, um, that's that's what he was for me. So um, yeah, I mean there are a lot of things. Um but like Chris, I said, I mean, just that every time you were with him, like you knew how proud of you he was of you. And so that um obviously makes makes you feel quite good and seen and respected and um acknowledged.

SPEAKER_14 1:38:22

And like in a quiet way, he made you want to be better. Like, not like a you know, wasn't like a parent that was like, you know, you gotta know your grace and be better, but he just you wanted to, he just lifted you up. Like he made you want to work harder and achieve more in a good way. Um and he was just interesting to have around. He always had really interesting stories, he was well researched, he was just a very interesting person, and he was funny and you know, enjoyable to be around. Some people are fun to be around. And he was, and and then it will just it will be he's gonna be a mist. There'll be a whole, you know, and I don't know. Biba, you know, he I think it's worth saying he adored Biba Barb. Um and his patience was legendary.

SPEAKER_03 1:39:11

Yeah, yeah. No, but I mean his stories, his knowledge, um, I would always luckily I got some of them on on camera. Um, so we have we have a a fair amount of of stories, but but there were many we did not. Um and so yeah, there's there's a lot that will be that will be missed.

SPEAKER_10 1:39:36

So I guess the next question would be is if you could sit down with him just one more time, what would you want to see?

SPEAKER_03 1:39:46

Well, we were I don't know if we lucky is not the right word. No, we we talked a little bit about this before, but um we did get to be with him in the hospital, so that was nice because we were able to sort of sit down with him when we knew it was one of the last or the last time that we would we would talk with him. Um, but I would tell him uh to tell us where all the important documents are. Write everything down so that so that this uh this process is is not as painstakingly uh hard as it it needs or it could be. Um so PSA.

SPEAKER_13 1:40:36

I'm making a moment.

SPEAKER_14 1:40:37

Anybody out there, uh, you know, yes, no matter your age, have a plan. Have a cell phone.

SPEAKER_02 1:40:43

And you know what's the worst one we experienced when we uh this when we lost my mom? The cell phone. The cell phone people are gonna be the ones that are gonna give you the hardest time. So be prepared for that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_14 1:40:52

Winston's phone is really bad the other day. He was he like, can I just take my dad's phone? And I was like, uh, let's just let's just the number of bless his heart, the number of attacks he gets daily from spam or from our political organizations is quite hilarious.

SPEAKER_03 1:41:12

But in reality, but in reality. Um yeah, I mean, I think I would, and it's kind of what like kind of what I said, like um it was it was a lot of thank yous and um and that the way he set all of this up for all of us to take this on and spread the word um is just a blessing and um you know something that not many people can do and not many people have ever no one has ever done quite quite like this. So um, you know, he gave us he gave us a lot, and so um you know, we're just we're we're so lucky for that, and and uh lucky is maybe not the right word. We're very um uh fortunate for it.

SPEAKER_13 1:42:08

When people talk about Jeff years from now, what do you hope they understand about him? What do you hope they say?

SPEAKER_03 1:42:14

I hope they understand that what he did for the running world really wasn't necessarily all about running. It's about people, it's about empowerment, it's about believing in yourself, and it transcends it transcends the running world because people would come up at Disney Expos and say you allowed me to finish this marathon. But I also now went to law school and I'm a lawyer and I didn't ever I didn't think that was possible, but you opened my life, my eyes to to the uh like some other possibility. And so um so yeah, just just that how how much belief can help people transcend their limitations, I guess. Um and running is a great way to start that process. Um and maybe some people it is just running, but for a lot of people it was more than just running.

SPEAKER_14 1:43:39

I mean, there's so many stories, and it's just we think about Run Disney as a community, and obviously Run, walk, run was was outside of Run Disney, but it was so impactful there. Um, just a quick story. There are these two women, you might know them if you run. They're uh two AWD athletes, two black women, Gail and Edie, and they walked together. They met each other at Run Disney, and after Jeff had passed, they always stopped me, they always give me the biggest hugs, they're the most joyful, wonderful women. And she said, I have to tell you a story that wouldn't exist without Jeff. They wouldn't have done this without Jeff. They would have never believed they could do this without Jeff. They wouldn't have met each other. They're both in the medical profession, and one year, one time about five years ago, there was a mom in with them at AWD, and she was like, They're like, You're both doctors. I always wanted to be a doctor, but I just I can't do it now. I have kids and I can't. And in the spirit of Jeff, they said, No, you can, like, you can. And they said it took like three years, and they convinced this woman, and she went back to school, and now she's a doctor helping other people. And it's because they met each other and they because of Jeff, and this one was there because of Jeff, and because we're there because of Jeff, we're open to all the things that the world can do for us because he brings people together to support other people. I know that's kind of a weird way to say it, but like that's kind of the beauty of what he gave us was like contagious. Like, no, I've done this. No, you can do this, no, we can do this. We can, you know, we can do hard things, and everybody can say all the time, but um, he gave us the belief, and I am no different than every one of your listeners because I announced my first race, got to interview Jeff, which I thought it was the coolest thing because I got to interview an Olympia, saw Marathon, and I was like, wait, I think that I could do that. He, you know, I used his training plane in this book for my first marathon. And at the end of the race, I saw him and I chased him down to get a picture with him. Like, I was just a fan like everybody else. And that's and it was 2005, and I just happened to meet this guy, you know, years later. But I've been on both sides of what Jeff can can give you. And and that belief, I always said to people, I finished my first marathon, and it was the first time I had done something that no one expected of me. You're supposed to go to school, you're supposed to go to high school, you're supposed to go to college, you're supposed to get a job, but like no one expected you to do a marathon. And so that kind of power and pride in yourself, it does, it fills your bucket and that goes into different areas. And that simple belief in that we can get to that finish line is what Jeff gave us. And our cat is very interesting.

SPEAKER_13 1:45:55

That's quite all right. Listening to you, I can almost hear our friends who are listening to this episode shouting out, yes, he helped me fill in the blank. Because that's that's what happened. How does the running community best honor his legacy?

SPEAKER_14 1:46:14

By keeping by continuing to run, walk, run. But I, you know, there's two sides of that. And the one thing that I thought wanted to stress is reminding people that if you take walk breaks, you're still a real runner.

SPEAKER_08 1:46:25

Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_14 1:46:26

Letting go of that stigma because getting to the finish line is what matters. And so, you know, I I hate when people are against it. Like, just try it. Um, so that's the one thing that I would say that you honor its legacy by moving forward and being that positive light for other people, not because you, not for your selfish reason, for the unselfish reason of like wanting to raise somebody up, but just genuinely wanting to raise other people up. You probably have a better answer.

SPEAKER_03 1:46:55

No, I was gonna go in a different direction because you went in that direction.

SPEAKER_14 1:46:59

Go in your direction. Roll.

SPEAKER_03 1:47:01

When when he started this whole thing, um running wasn't as much about uh joy uh as as it is now. Um and it he kind of helped open the door to running being an enjoyment, enjoyable activity, and helped people acknowledge that you can slow down, you can have more fun with this, you can stop for characters, it it's all okay. Walking is okay in a in a race. Um, you know, you potentially might get to the finish line faster. Uh seven minutes in a half marathon and 14 minutes in a full marathon. Um but but uh but yeah, no the you know you you can continue it by having joyful runs. Um by giving that joy to other people. Welcome, you know, invite them on a run. Um tell them about the empowerment that that you have gotten, and and hopefully they can find it too. Um yeah, just passing passing it on. Everybody has the ability to influence a lot of people, and um and this one is a it's a fairly sort of easy one because it is it brings you so many good things from a health standpoint, from a mental standpoint, um, from a life standpoint.

SPEAKER_13 1:48:39

Is there anything else you'd like to share with the community that loved Jeff so much?

SPEAKER_14 1:48:44

I just want to thank everybody for how amazing everybody was um during Princess. Everybody was so kind and the love that we felt for Jeff was really um really special. And thanking Disney for how they honored him as well. And just thank you guys. And like we said, please keep doing run walk around. We've lost Jeff, but what Jeff built will continue to grow. And we just all we want as a family is for people to run walk around to get that joy, you know, and Chris is there to help, and the local training groups are there, and there's still gonna be a run Disney. So, you know, don't let him be forgotten because he spent his whole life and he would have spent the next million years doing it.

SPEAKER_03 1:49:21

I think just continuing to grow the community. Um you bring more people in. The the more fun you have, the more fun people see you're having. Tell your story, um, and and continue, yeah, continue bringing other people in to this this wonderful community that you guys have, that Run Disney has, um, that running has, and the world will be a better place.

Final Reflections And Carrying Legacy

SPEAKER_12 1:49:49

Caution runners, the topic is about to change right now.

SPEAKER_13 1:49:55

Well, friends, it it took us a couple of weeks to bring that all back. Together. But the legends that we had Ambi Burfoot, Bill Rogers, Dean Canassis, Chris Twiggs and the Galloway family. Now, Chris and the Galloway family had been with us before. But when I asked those giants of racing to join the Rise and Run podcast, as soon as they found out it was for Jeff Calloway, no questions asked. Sure. What can we do? And it was a real pleasure and an honor speaking to everyone who's been on the podcast tonight.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:33

I think being part of some of those interviews and obviously added in them all together. You know, the one thing that struck me, and I'm why I'm so glad we did this episode, is that you know the one thing I loved about Jeff is that he was a fantastic storyteller.

SPEAKER_13 1:50:51

He was.

SPEAKER_02 1:50:52

And in all the times that we had him on this podcast, we heard some of the same stories several times. And but regardless though, they made us smile. But what I appreciated is being able to talk to all these individuals to get news stories that brought just as big of a smile to my face as the stories that Jeff told. And I think those are memories that I will hold on through my entire, not just running career, but just you know, life in general. And and the other thing that I truly do appreciate, and this came through I feel like crystal clear when we were talking with Weston and Carissa. And you know, it's part of the grieving process, is I really appreciated that even through all the tears, we were still able to find things to give us belly laughs, make us smile, and make us smile. And I I think that's what makes this healing process for all of us uh just gonna be a little bit easier.

SPEAKER_13 1:51:53

I agree.

SPEAKER_09 1:51:54

We planned this out. We didn't want this somber episode, like a morning episode. We want this to be more of a celebration of Jeff and his life, because I think that's exactly what he would have wanted, and uh we we all we all need. No doubt about that, John.

SPEAKER_13 1:52:09

No doubt at all. So as we wrap this up, it's clear that Jeff's impact went well beyond races or training plans or high fives at finish lines. His legacy lives on in the people he encouraged, in us, the confidence he helped us build, and the countless runners who found their way because he believed in them first. If you've ever taken that first step you weren't sure you could, if you've ever been out on a tough day and you've kept going, if you ever felt like you belonged in this family, there's a good chance that Jeff had something to do with that. The best way we can honor him is simple. We keep showing up for each other, we keep encouraging one another, we keep making this sport as welcoming and as joyful as he did. Jeff, thank you for everything. And to all of you listening, thank you for being part of this wonderful community. Until next time, happy running.

SPEAKER_17 1:53:35

The Rise and Run Podcast discusses general information about Run Disney and is in no way affiliated with Run Disney or the Walt Disney Company. Any information or advice discussed on this podcast should not be considered medical advice. It should always consult with your healthcare provider or event organizer.

SPEAKER_04 1:53:57

The anthem is fun for every heart that runs.